Vegetable & Herb Garden

[Samantha]

For the first time in 18 years, I finally have a yard big enough for a vegetable garden. The back yard is presently a mix of weeds and overgrown shrubs, but there's plenty of room for a garden, with lots of sunlight. Rather than trying to amend the soil, I've decided to put in raised beds on top of the existing hardpan.

I've just started on the design process, both for the beds themselves and how/what will be planted. I live in Spokane, at the eastern edge of Washington, and just over 100 miles South of the Canadian border. The area is identified as USDA Zone 6 for plant hardiness, -23 to -18 C (-10 to 0 F) as potential wintertime lows; with a growing season from early May through Sept; although it is not unusual to experience a killing frost as late as mid-May or even early June, but I should be able to overcome that potential with row covers, as long as the ground warms up enough to plant.

In addition to the vegetable garden in the back yard, I'm planning an herb garden for the side yard outside the kitchen door, which will be in pots that I can easily move as required to take advantage of the necessary sun/shade combination.

By biggest problem right now is narrowing down what I'm going to plant. I want to grow it all, but also don't want to spend all summer tending the garden. Anybody have any tips, suggestions, recommendations?

[Skitterbug]

For the first time in 18 years, I finally have a yard big enough for a vegetable garden. The back yard is presently a mix of weeds and overgrown shrubs, but there's plenty of room for a garden, with lots of sunlight. Rather than trying to amend the soil, I've decided to put in raised beds on top of the existing hardpan.

I've just started on the design process, both for the beds themselves and how/what will be planted. I live in Spokane, at the eastern edge of Washington, and just over 100 miles South of the Canadian border. The area is identified as USDA Zone 6 for plant hardiness, -23 to -18 C (-10 to 0 F) as potential wintertime lows; with a growing season from early May through Sept; although it is not unusual to experience a killing frost as late as mid-May or even early June, but I should be able to overcome that potential with row covers, as long as the ground warms up enough to plant.

In addition to the vegetable garden in the back yard, I'm planning an herb garden for the side yard outside the kitchen door, which will be in pots that I can easily move as required to take advantage of the necessary sun/shade combination.

By biggest problem right now is narrowing down what I'm going to plant. I want to grow it all, but also don't want to spend all summer tending the garden. Anybody have any tips, suggestions, recommendations?

I think I would first decide what sort of fresh veggies and herbs do I enjoy eating and preserving? You will also have to consider how much time you have for growing your crops? 3 months maybe?

My hubby also went with raised beds. They are easier to work in since the soil is in "perfect condition". We tend to have soggy conditions in our yard when it rains so having our beds raised helps avoid drowning out our garden. Granted, the beds will dry out a little faster but for us adding water is much easier than waiting for the soil to dry out.

We've already started leeks <because they take quite awhile to develop> and tomatoes <because we want to enjoy them as early as possible!> And I have flowers started as well - petunias, impatiens, snapdragons, hibiscus and geraniums! It beats buying them by the flats from the local nursery! I'll start marigolds, zinnia, etc. when it is closer to spring since they grow faster! Anyway, I'm going on a bit so I'll stop and let you enjoy browsing in your garden seed catalogs!

[johbot]

We went with raised garden beds, finally, as well. Interesting, Skitter, your comments about the soil and it drying out. We dont get much rain here (we had an inch at Christmas and haven't seen a cloud in the sky since). We are finding that the soil is staying moist for longer! But we do have the beds lined with heavy duty plastic to extend the life of the timber.
Despite the moisture in the soil and the straw to keep it there, some plants really do not like the hot days and have just shrivelled up and died.
We have four beds, each 1 metre x 3 metres. We were a bit late with getting it started this summer so we still have one bed completely empty. But that helps with the planning and the scheduling of the planting for the winter vegies.
As for what to plant, I agree with the suggestion that you plant what you will eat. We currently have tomatoes, spinach, eggplant, capsicums, spring onions, zuchini and basil. Very soon, we will start the seeds for beetroot, peas, cauliflower, broccoli and lettuce so they are ready for the antumn plantings. We plan to plant beds successively so that we always have one free and we are not totally inundated with produce at the one time. That's the plan anyway.

[Samantha]

I think I would first decide what sort of fresh veggies and herbs do I enjoy eating and preserving?

Ah, that's the problem -- we love just about all vegetables & herbs. Last year, in lieu of a garden, I belonged to a CSA where we received weekly deliveries of fresh, local vegetables, and at the end of the season, received a bonus delivery of six different crops: beets, chard, corn, potatoes and carrots. I simply stored the potatoes in a cool place, but I froze and canned the rest, so I'm already prepared for that eventuality.

You will also have to consider how much time you have for growing your crops? 3 months maybe?

I think we can count on at least a 4-month growing season, with judicious use of coverings at the beginning and end of the season, and the brassica can thrive into late November.

We've already started leeks <because they take quite awhile to develop> and tomatoes <because we want to enjoy them as early as possible!>

I'm not set up this year to start seedlings indoors, so I've already planned on getting my tomato plants from the nursery once the soil warms up.

And I have flowers started as well - petunias, impatiens, snapdragons, hibiscus and geraniums! It beats buying them by the flats from the local nursery! I'll start marigolds, zinnia, etc. when it is closer to spring since they grow faster!

I know my limits -- this yard has been totally neglected for many years, so this year I'm going to concentrate on getting my vegetable garden started and slowly cleaning out the neglected remainder. Next year (or this Fall if all goes well), I'll turn my attention to replanting the flower gardens.

[GeoffW]

Today's signboard may be appropriate.

[Samantha]

Perfect thyming!

[Samantha]

Does anybody have any experience with the globe variety of zucchini? A couple of years ago I was the recipient of a friend's excess production of a round zucchini that was about the size of a basketball. It was hollow inside, similar to a pumpkin, the flesh was moist and sweet, and the skin remained tender and edible.

Unfortunately, it seems there are several different varieties of globe zucchini, and my friend can't recall exactly which one he planted. He picked the plants up from a nursery on a whim, and didn't keep any records.

[ChrisGreaves]

I've decided to put in raised beds on top of the existing hardpan.

I think these are a good idea. Easier to control the spoil and moisture content (better drainage etc.)
I think you already know about gardening, the basics at any rate, and you know that the first year will take more time than any other (trips to the store to get a roll of netting, linseed oil for the hoe-handle etc.) so why not go with three sure-fire winners.
Pick the 3 vegetables that you absolutely LOVE fresh, and grow those.
Let's suppose you would kill for fresh string green beans, where you wait until the pan of water is boiling, walk out to the bean poles, harvest a bowl of beans and RUN back to the kitchen, chop and boil for 2 minutes, serve with a dab of butter, salt and pepper and eat them on the swing-seat on the porch.
At the end of the first year you will be filled with a sense of accomplishment and gratitude for the luxuries of the three fresh vegetables (and fruits) that you most enjoy, which will slingshot you into the second year.

As a counter, suppose you decided to plant only potatoes. At the end of the year you'd be left with the nagging feeling that potatoes are $5 a ton (quantities may vary) at your local supermarket, and "What's so special about spuds anyway?"

I'd say, Go with 3 luxury items that will grow in your climate.
Treat yourself to success this first year.

[GeoffW]

Perfect thyming!

Some more thyming.

This thread gave me the idea for today's sign.

[Hey Jude]

Perfect thyming!

Some more thyming.

This thread gave me the idea for today's sign.

parsing some sage advice no doubt

[Fredrick27]

Hello everyone,

Sorry to revive this old topic, but I came across it while looking for advice on starting my own garden, and it seemed really inspiring. Like many of you at the time, I'm just getting started and want to plant my first organic leeks as soon as the warm weather arrives.

Are any of the tips shared here still valid today? And would you have any other specific tips for growing leeks successfully, especially for a beginner? I want to make sure I get off to a good start on this adventure and get a healthy, tasty harvest.

Thanks in advance for your help and suggestions

[ChrisGreaves]

Hello everyone,

Well!
I must say that I AM disappointed; woke up this morning and saw a nice fat juicy thread into which I could sink my teeth.
Indeed a chthonic(†) thread.
Just as I was clearing out space on my hard drive to compose several replies I noticed that the thread was begun fifteen years ago.

OK. I'm not really disappointed; I've been waiting to spring "chthonic " on Eileen's Lounge for a month or so now, and Lo! like Spring it springs forth.

Thanks in advance for your help and suggestions

Another disappointment; I thought I was the only member allowed to use "evilgrin" but anyway "WELCOME ABOARD"

An on-topic response follows in a few minutes
Cheers, Chris

(†) I purposely did Not provide a link; before you-all rush off to Wikipedia, pause a moment and think about how you would pronounce this word. In context : "... but as residents of chthinic origin". I reached for a pencil to circle the typo, and then thought "Hang about! This is a respected author". The sparsity of vowels struck me. "The Colony of Unrequited Dreams" p 454 Wayne Johnson ISBN 0-385-49542-0

[ChrisGreaves]

Sorry to revive this old topic, but I came across it while looking for advice on starting my own garden, and it seemed really inspiring. Like many of you at the time, I'm just getting started and want to plant my first organic leeks as soon as the warm weather arrives.

My earlier responses were written BEFORE I moved to Bonavista, and were written some twenty years after I had last had a garden.
I have been gardening in this pimple on the end of the Bonavista Peninsula for six very short summers now, and would in brief add:-

(1) In your first couple of years in a new place, or in starting gardening, grow as much of everything as you can. Two+ years from now when you know what grows and what doesn’t, start growing what you need and want that has proved itself in your environment

(2) Ignore general advice on the internet, such as “You can vermicompost outdoors year around”, without first checking that the poster is not based in North Carolina.

(3) Ignore too general cautions about weather. We all live in micro-climatic regions such as The Okanagan Valley, and I suspect regions as small as twenty square miles.

(4) On my 60'x90' house lot in Bonavista I am lightly plagued by snails and slugs, so in my first two years some vegetables were eaten away; that said two years of an early-morning patrol with a long-handled shovel seems to have almost eliminated snails on my plastic siding on the house and the shed. Other house lots in Bonavista swear that they have no slug/snail problems, but then perhaps they are not growing strawberries, right?

(5) Grow whatever you can get you hands on. I grow enough Jerusalem Artichokes to satisfy the entire Bonavista Peninsula, mainly because no-one here will eat them, mainly because no-one here knows about them. They are better than potatoes (which every man and his dog DOES grow) because, unlike potato tubers, Jerusalem Artichoke tubers survive the long winter and can be harvested in early spring as soon as the ground thaws.

(6) Trust your brain before the brain of other locals. When I announced that I was going to start a vegetable garden, the most common response was, and here I quote, “You can’t garden here; it’s too cold, it’s too wet, it’s too windy. It’s all rock and there’s no soil”. I countered with “I’ll make compost”, and quicker’n’blink “You can’t compost here; it won’t rot down in time”. I now manage Bonavista’s largest continuous flow modular composting system and from my initial four gooseberry bushes (“Gooseberry? What those?”) two years ago, I will be try to give away a hundred gooseberry shrubs this coming summer.

(7) http://www.chrisgreaves.com/LandfallGardenHouse/index.htm contains many ideas that can be considered for the home gardener.

(8) In particular http://www.chrisgreaves.com/LandfallGardenHouse/Diary/Diary.htm is a month-by month summary of my outdoor activities.

Once again, WELCOME ABOARD
Cheers, Chris

[Amelia43]

Your courage in ignoring the naysayers is inspiring, Chris. Gardening is an ongoing living (hopefully!) experiment and little is lost by following your instincts and attempting the so-called impossible.

[ChrisGreaves]

Your courage in ignoring the naysayers is inspiring, Chris. Gardening is an ongoing living (hopefully!) experiment and little is lost by following your instincts and attempting the so-called impossible.

Thank you Amelia
Your response is very encouraging.
That's so like a woman!
I cannot take all the credit.
As a Western Australian, to which are affiliated The Eastern States , my 40 years spent in Canada have taught me how few people realize the size of Australia. In most school atlases Australia looks like "A large island surrounded by sea water", so when people ask me "what can be grown in Australia" I reply "Everything that can be grown in North America⁽¹⁾".
@geoffw I invite your comments!

Now the range of fruits and vegetables grown in North America, or at least, that can be grown in various parts of North America, is huge.
Snap Quiz: Name a product in your local supermarket that you know for a fact can not be grown in North America. If you nominate "cocoa" I am likely to respond that cocoa CAN be grown in North America, but admittedly it cannot be grown commercially in North America, ad nauseam.

Some office workers in downtown Toronto, Canada, those with a south-facing window, grow pineapple trees from the crown of a supermarket pineapple.

My habit of gainsaying the naysayers probably springs from my being raised in Western Australia, a rebel state that puts Texas to shame (are you listening BobH? )

As for attempting the impossible, I've been doing that since May 1967!

⁽¹⁾ as in "Canada and the USA"
Cheers, Chris

[Amelia43]

As a longterm resident of the other side of Australia (Queensland) I can vouch for your adventurous approach to gardening. We have our failures, but it is a lifelong learning process, nothing ventured, nothing gained..................

[GeoffW]

North America is not only USA and Canada. Mexico is in North America, as is much of Central America. Cocoa is grown in Mexico, and I have actually been to a cocoa plantation in Costa Rica. So North America encompasses almost all latitudes from a little north of the equator to slightly south of the north pole. So, climatically, I'd say anything can be grown in North America.

Of course, most people really mean Canada and USA when referring to North America (which offends many Mexicans). But cocoa is also grown in Puerto Rico, which is a US territory.

Size wise, Australia is slightly smaller than the contiguous mainland USA.

Thanks to a dish we had when eating out a few months ago, and inspired by you, I have Jerusalem artichokes.

20241107_175413~2_copy_692x714.jpg

This picture was taken before they went even crazier, they went to almost 3m and are falling over now.To the left, climbing the fence, are passion fruit. I've also got mango, avocado, fig, various citrus, some stone fruit as well as a range of vegetables. We've only been in this place for 12 months, and the climate has ensured that the plants have grown well.

[ChrisGreaves]

As a longterm resident of the other side of Australia (Queensland) I can vouch for your adventurous approach to gardening. We have our failures, but it is a lifelong learning process, nothing ventured, nothing gained...

Didn't you have a premier once, a peanut; farmer of Queensland?
Cheers, Chris

[ChrisGreaves]

Thanks to a dish we had when eating out a few months ago, and inspired by you, I have Jerusalem artichokes. ... This picture was taken before they went even crazier, they went to almost 3m and are falling over now.To the left, climbing the fence, are passion fruit. I've also got mango, avocado, fig, various citrus, some stone fruit as well as a range of vegetables. We've only been in this place for 12 months, and the climate has ensured that the plants have grown well.

Hooray! A convert!
Do you have the name of the variety?
I ordered my original stok from https://chokedup.ca/, although I first met Jerusalem artichokes in the little house we bought in Gawler South Australia (think San Diego USA)

I am glad to hear that your 'chokes too grow tall enough to fall over; when mine topple I just leave them where they fall, it doesn't seem to damage the tubers at all, at all. In particular the tubers don't seem to form oxalic acid on exposure to light. Another strike against potatoes.

If you want to earn my respect and have a chance at becoming a good friend of mine, don't mention your range of species of fruit trees again
Cheers, Chris

[GeoffW]

The variety was not mentioned in the order.

One item I read suggested that, after they fall over, they cN be cut back to about 1.5m, which will direct more energy to producing tubers.